Ratchet's dawn of the Dragon Discussion THread

ratchet · Oct 14, 2008 9:30 AM

Hi everyone. As we all know, DOTD is being released in 6 days, and i've just made this topic to chat about a few things.
1.Mobile Phone game- I recently turned on my dad's phone and went to see what games there are to buy, and what do you know, DOTD was there, a week and a half before its US release. It was $7 and i didn't buy it because i probably wouldn't play it anyway, it looked dodgy, besides my dad would get anygry at me.

2."Trapped in Time"- I have already discovered a plothole in the TLOS series. When Spyro & Cynder were Trapped in Time, weren't they supposed to be TRAPPED IN TIME. this would mean that they wouldn't age at all. It doesn't make any sense. Now some may say that they were only frozen in Crystal. Well even QITHOUT magic, in the real word if you freeze someone they stay in their current state. Owell.

3.Green snake things- Supposebly, Spyro and Cynder cant get too far way from each other due to the green snake collars around they're neck. This is just a copy of Ratchet Deadlock's Deadlock collar, but i'm not going to get technical on this one, its only very minor But I dont know why The enemies put this thing there. Owell.

4.Release Date- Originally it was october 7, then october 28, now its finally confirmed October 21.
OK, i'm a bit late, i took a brief brake from Spyro for a while and i'm only JUST catching up.
Just so everyone knows its
Australia-Nov 5
Europe-Nov 14
Japan-Nov 29

5.Cynder's Random Abilities- Well, it has been confirmed that Cynder can control poison, wind shadow and Fear. Now this contains 3 plotholes.
A.Wasn't the purple dragon the only one who can control more than one ability? That was one of the reasons why Spyro was so special! Eh! Some say "Cause The DM was a purple dragon he could teach Cynder these abilities." well then that means that Spyro can teach everyone the abilities. Dragonsare BORN with most of these abilities somehow programmed into them, they dont just gain them, unless they are a powerful purple dragon.
B.What About Cynder's Fire? She had that in her dark form, why not now. THE developers have said that she gained her wind, poison, fear and shadow from her evil form, why not her fire?
C.If Cynder had gained these abilities during her dark form why didn't she ever used them? All she used was pathetic flame and swipe.

6.The characters new looks-Cynder and Spyro look great to be honest, no problems. Sparx looks different but genuinly better. If he originaslly looked like that in ANB i would of slightly prefered it. Hunter looks retared, nothing liked he looked like, but thats exaculy what i suspected anyway so really not a suprise.
As for the guardians, i havn't yet seen a piccie of them. If anyone can show me one, i'll comment on em.

7.Twists-I wonder what twists or surprises there might be in the game.
Will they do a boring no twist finalle?
Will they give a reall cliche twist?
Heres just a few theories:
-Spyro and Cynder will fall in love
-Ignitus is Spyro's father
-Spyro will meet his parents
-The dark Master is Spyro's father
-The chronicler is Spyro's father
-The chronicler is Spyro in the future
-THe dark master is Spyro in the future
-Ignitus, Spyro, Cynder or one of the other guardians will die
-Chronicler and the Dark Master are related
I honestly dont believe any of these, except number 1, which you see comming.

Well, The games being released in around 20 days for us Australians. I might get it on the day, maybe not. I'm not that excited really, as some people here anyway.
Just So everyone knows, i'm not being critical, So please stop saying things like "STOP BASHING STOP BASHING STOP BASHING" because all of my critisims here is constructive.
Thankyou

Ember · Oct 14, 2008 12:24 PM

I think the Dark Master and Ignitus may be brothers or related in some way. I also think Ignitus will die, because even if he isn't, he acts like a father to Spyro.

dagz · Oct 14, 2008 12:28 PM

i think that the chronicler was one of the dragons that sealed away the dark master in convexity in the first place yikes yikes

minredd · Oct 14, 2008 3:09 PM

It's a game. you don't have to get so technical.

1. No one knows why the mobile is out yet, but ten to one says half the stuff in it isn't cannon.

2. They might've been only protected from the collapsing mountain, it never said they wouldn't age.

3. There are a LOT of things that have been overused. Are you kidding? There's a million carbon copy shooter games out there(Halo, Call of Duty, Mercenaries 2).

4. Only the USA release date is confirmed. The rest are all rumors.

5. Because it wouldn't be fair to give Spyro four abilities and only give Cynder one. They needed an equilibrium, and by "the Dark Master teaching her" it means that a bit of Malefor's power could still be inside her.

6. Why mention their looks if you don't care? And here is a picture of the guardians. Don't complain, everyone knows they look weird.

7. It will probably be a cliche' ending, but I don't mind that. You have to get into the game to enjoy cliches'. Ten to one says Ignitus will die because they always kill off the fatherly/motherly character.

There big_smile This game me something to do. Sorry if I'm mean, but I'm sick and we've probably already seen these complains ten times over by now.

Stormy · Oct 14, 2008 5:53 PM

[sub]So many obvious plotholes when the game hasn't even been released yet. -__-

In my opinion, Cynder's elements wouldn't have been an issue at all if they hadn't played up the "special chosen purple dragon" crap. Aside from the whole "how can you breathe fear" thing. =/[/sub]

Neotyguy40 · Oct 14, 2008 6:59 PM

1. The mobile developers aren't the same people that do the REAL DotD...

2. There are many theories, it could be they didn't age in the crystal, but when they get out of it their age accelerated instantly, but there could be many ways.

3. No, it wasn't a copy from deadlocked. They were originally made to keep a single screen for co-op mode, but then they decided to make it part of the storyline.

4. Well, unfortunately they keep changing the dates. It might release tomorrow, it might release next year (*gasp*), but hopefully they will be true to their word.

5. If you read my post somewhere, I pointed this out too, but we don't know why this is. I would've gave Cynder these:

Shadow
Fear
Death
Aura

At least those would be close enough to be considered one element...

6. Couldn't of said it better myself... I would've made Hunter the same personality as the old one.

P.S. It's great to have you back ratchet!

John Man 1234 · Oct 14, 2008 8:06 PM

I think number one of the endings is right on the mark. As for everything else good job have a nice day and welcome back.

Trasher258 · Oct 14, 2008 9:51 PM

...I'm just sharing my thoughts related to TLoS and StD. Including this game in general.

Hunter does look different but that doesn't mean he doesn't remember Spyro in Ripto's Rage/Gateway to Glimmer. He never introduces himself but he blurts out Spyro the first time you talk to him in-game. Plus, he seemed surprised that he was a dragon. I thought he would know that already. I don't wish of the idea of a twin brother...ugh...maybe something happened to him?

Well, that's beside the point. Ratchet does have a good point about being "Trapped in Time" but I also though he wouldn't age while trapped in crystal. THAT doesn't make much sense. How did Spyro even make that crystal? Too many questions to answer... the only excuse would be magic. A word that means that it isn't any known fact of what or how something occurs "scientifically" or something. I thought that since dragons were mention as the source of magic (In YotD, this fact is mentioned) they may somehow emit some sort of particles.

Syler Bladewing · Oct 15, 2008 12:51 AM

I think what happened, again, was that the crystal created a separate time/space area for the two. They weren't frozen in time inside the crystal, but just outside it, they were. They still aged normally, but that didn't look like it until they were out of the crystal. Just my thought.

Kazoobie64 · Oct 15, 2008 1:26 AM

Neotyguy40 wrote:

2. There are many theories, it could be they didn't age in the crystal, but when they get out of it their age accelerated instantly, but there could be many ways.

Oh come on, TEN put an entire emphasis on Spyro's time abilities. Is he suddenly going to conveniently get an ability to make a safety crystal that has nothing to do with time at the end? Besides, you can clearly see them already aged inside the crystal before they are released.

ratchet · Oct 15, 2008 10:35 AM

minredd wrote:

It's a game. you don't have to get so technical.
1. No one knows why the mobile is out yet, but ten to one says half the stuff in it isn't cannon.
2. They might've been only protected from the collapsing mountain, it never said they wouldn't age.
3. There are a LOT of things that have been overused. Are you kidding? There's a million carbon copy shooter games out there(Halo, Call of Duty, Mercenaries 2).
4. Only the USA release date is confirmed. The rest are all rumors.
5. Because it wouldn't be fair to give Spyro four abilities and only give Cynder one. They needed an equilibrium, and by "the Dark Master teaching her" it means that a bit of Malefor's power could still be inside her.
6. Why mention their looks if you don't care? And here is a picture of the guardians. Don't complain, everyone knows they look weird.
7. It will probably be a cliche' ending, but I don't mind that. You have to get into the game to enjoy cliches'. Ten to one says Ignitus will die because they always kill off the fatherly/motherly character.
There This game me something to do. Sorry if I'm mean, but I'm sick and we've probably already seen these complains ten times over by now.

1. Another reason why i didn't get it

2.They were supposed to be trapped in time, atleast thats what the developers said

3.Yeah, I know.

4.hmmm, yeah, i've heard like 100 dates. Someone said that DOTD would be released on Nov 12 in Australia

5.Its still a plothole, Seeing the Purple dragon is the only one who is really supposed to be able to use 4 powers. And i'd say thats why they originaly didn't give Cynder 4 powers.

6.I'm really starting just a discussion. Oh and thanks for that picture.
The guardians dont look too different either

7.Who knows what'll happen. I just hope its not a really boring ending like "Dark Masters dead, Yay!"
I really want to get something that we didn't see comming.

And no, i'm not complaining, just starting discussion.

cynderfire · Oct 16, 2008 9:49 AM

I think the guardians will die........and I dont want it to happen! :omg: :omg:

ratchet · Oct 16, 2008 9:59 AM

who knows. I would download the game on my mobile and complete it, but i dont think my dad would let me.

Neotyguy40 · Oct 17, 2008 7:00 PM

I wish they made an iPhone/iPod touch version... Similar to the DS version.

domino · Oct 18, 2008 8:19 AM

My friend keeps on saying stuff like 'What if Malefor is Spyro's father?'

Malefor: Spyro, I am your father
Mark hamil plays malefor so I bet he knews that scene very well

minredd · Oct 18, 2008 1:07 PM

Malefor's generations old and has been sealed away O.o I don't see how he could be.

Also on another site someone said something interesting. Maybe the fact that Cynder was corrupted by a purple dragon is how she got four powers. If it had been any other kind of dragon she wouldn't have. It made more sense before I typed it XD;

John Man 1234 · Oct 18, 2008 1:36 PM

Poison, Shadow and Fear. She probaly got those powers do to Malefor's torcher and Gaul's harsh things. But wind dosen't seem like an element that's evil she probaly learns that elsewhere. And your most likely talking about the sierra fourms correct?

Neotyguy40 · Oct 18, 2008 4:55 PM

John Man 1234 wrote:

Poison, Shadow and Fear. She probaly got those powers do to Malefor's torcher and Gaul's harsh things. But wind dosen't seem like an element that's evil she probaly learns that elsewhere. And your most likely talking about the sierra fourms correct?

I think shadow and fear go together.

Razz · Oct 18, 2008 6:46 PM

I don't know if anyone has addressed your "plot hole" points or not, but I'm going to anyway. big_smile

2.Trapped in Time: we don't actually know how the time fury works. Add to that, it is never stated in-game that Spyro and Cynder are trapped in time. Regardless, it is not a plot hole for them to age in there because, it being magic and all, anything can happen in that crystal.

3.Green snake things- They're a plot device and they're necessary to make the gameplay work. If Spyro and Cynder weren't attached to each other, the game really wouldn't work out half as well. And I'm pretty sure Insomniac wasn't the first game company to use this idea, either. Lots of games get ideas from other games. Just look at what GTA did to video games as a whole.

4.Release Date- All the other release dates listed before we found out that it was the 21st were pretty much just rumor and speculation and never came from the source (that source being Sierra).

5.Cynder's Random Abilities-
A.Wasn't the purple dragon the only one who can control more than one ability?

Cynder's abilities are just that: abilities. Whereas the purple dragon can control all the elements. The only element Cynder has control over is wind. All of her other powers were put on her by a purple dragon (Malefor) and are related to darkness.

B.What About Cynder's Fire?

This was something given to her by the Dark Master and she only had it as Dark Cynder. You'll notice that her fire in ANB was weaker than Spyro's most basic flame attacks and it was an odd, mutated, purplish color, which indicates that it was never her power to begin with.

C.If Cynder had gained these abilities during her dark form why didn't she ever used them?

Overconfidence would be my guess. big_smile And perhaps she couldn't use them when she was corrupted (we don't actually know what her attacks in DotD look like, after all, so we don't know if they'd be possible for her to use). This is, ultimately, a very minor nit pick.

Neotyguy40 · Oct 18, 2008 7:24 PM

Razz wrote:

I don't know if anyone has addressed your "plot hole" points or not, but I'm going to anyway.
2.Trapped in Time: we don't actually know how the time fury works. Add to that, it is never stated in-game that Spyro and Cynder are trapped in time. Regardless, it is not a plot hole for them to age in there because, it being magic and all, anything can happen in that crystal.
3.Green snake things- They're a plot device and they're necessary to make the gameplay work. If Spyro and Cynder weren't attached to each other, the game really wouldn't work out half as well. And I'm pretty sure Insomniac wasn't the first game company to use this idea, either. Lots of games get ideas from other games. Just look at what GTA did to video games as a whole.
4.Release Date- All the other release dates listed before we found out that it was the 21st were pretty much just rumor and speculation and never came from the source (that source being Sierra).
5.Cynder's Random Abilities-
A.Wasn't the purple dragon the only one who can control more than one ability?
Cynder's abilities are just that: abilities. Whereas the purple dragon can control all the elements. The only element Cynder has control over is wind. All of her other powers were put on her by a purple dragon (Malefor) and are related to darkness.
B.What About Cynder's Fire?
This was something given to her by the Dark Master and she only had it as Dark Cynder. You'll notice that her fire in ANB was weaker than Spyro's most basic flame attacks and it was an odd, mutated, purplish color, which indicates that it was never her power to begin with.
C.If Cynder had gained these abilities during her dark form why didn't she ever used them?
Overconfidence would be my guess. And perhaps she couldn't use them when she was corrupted (we don't actually know what her attacks in DotD look like, after all, so we don't know if they'd be possible for her to use). This is, ultimately, a very minor nit pick.

Maybe that darkish flame is shadow or fear?

minredd · Oct 18, 2008 8:54 PM

I love how Razz explains things XD It makes everything make sense. Maybe it's because she's like... A lot older then I am X3

As for the shadow flame being shadow or fear, I don't think it is. We've seen some of the breaths, fear is like a red pulse wave and shadow is like... Well, one of the attacks is she goes into the ground into a black-purple shadow thing then comes out and attacks.

Stormy · Oct 18, 2008 11:50 PM

Razz wrote:

Cynder's abilities are just that: abilities. Whereas the purple dragon can control all the elements. The only element Cynder has control over is wind. All of her other powers were put on her by a purple dragon (Malefor) and are related to darkness.

[sub]Wind is an element? And the purple dragon can control all the elements? Then why can't Spyro control wind?

And magical crystal or not, the fact that they aged when they were supposed to be frozen in time makes no sense. The only purpose of the aging that I can see is so that the "Spyro and Cynder relationship" can be more plausible, which is, in my opinion, sloppy and lazy.

But I guess it's only a video game; it's not really meant to be analyzed this much. =P[/sub]

Kazoobie64 · Oct 19, 2008 12:16 AM

Yeah seriously, I would have preferred they say something like "well, we didn't agree with their ages in the first two games so just assume that they were that age the whole time in the past two games and the crystal changed nothing for the sake of re-design" rather than to try and make it work, because it just seems like incredibly sloppy writing like Stormy said.

It's the same basic principle as for why Cynder's jewelry magically returns. Rather than try to explain it by some nonsensical plot, they probably just went with the whole "it's better this way, just pretend it was like this the whole time" which is fine with me.

minredd · Oct 19, 2008 3:14 AM

It was said by the makers Cynder had her gauntlets again because it helped her overcome something or other. I lost my train of thought halfway through that sentence. But they said they would've made a cut scene for it but it would've been awkward.

ratchet · Oct 19, 2008 11:11 AM

Face it, the Writers of TLOS are lazy and Sloppy.
As Kazoobie said, another plothole is Cynder's Jewelery....hmmmm

My friend keeps on saying stuff like 'What if Malefor is Spyro's father?'
Malefor: Spyro, I am your father
Mark hamil plays malefor so I bet he knews that scene very well

I highly doubt it.
If Malefor concieved the egg, he obviously would've had a close relationship with who he concieved with. Meaning that he would know when it was born and as soon as it was born would've smashed it or raised it like cynder. He wouldn't give the purple egg of prophecy to the dragons!

Malefor's generations old and has been sealed away O.o I don't see how he could be.

Theres another reason for you...

Also on another site someone said something interesting. Maybe the fact that Cynder was corrupted by a purple dragon is how she got four powers. If it had been any other kind of dragon she wouldn't have. It made more sense before I typed it XD;

Yeah, but the fact that the Purple Dragon is the only one Supposed to ever have more than one ability, Otherwise Spyro or other purple Dragons could just teach others the ability, and wouldn't be as special. Dragons have to actually have the Magic inside of them first.

2.Trapped in Time: we don't actually know how the time fury works. Add to that, it is never stated in-game that Spyro and Cynder are trapped in time. Regardless, it is not a plot hole for them to age in there because, it being magic and all, anything can happen in that crystal

Yes, we dont know the full magic. But suspended annimation that Ages people is just pure stupidity, As Stormy said, they probably just made it like that to Make Spyro and Cynders relationship, as well As fulfill "all the fan's dreams" of Spyro "growing up". And Probably also to explain why they can suddenly fly.

3.Green snake things- They're a plot device and they're necessary to make the gameplay work. If Spyro and Cynder weren't attached to each other, the game really wouldn't work out half as well. And I'm pretty sure Insomniac wasn't the first game company to use this idea, either. Lots of games get ideas from other games. Just look at what GTA did to video games as a whole.

Yah, thats true, but i found it stupid the fact why the people who captured spyro and cynder put the collar around their necks, why didn't they just lock them up with the green snake things seeing they're so unbreakable. But i realise why they wanted Spyro and Cynder to stick together.
But dont worry about number 3 that much.

5.Cynder's Random Abilities-
A.Wasn't the purple dragon the only one who can control more than one ability?
Cynder's abilities are just that: abilities. Whereas the purple dragon can control all the elements. The only element Cynder has control over is wind. All of her other powers were put on her by a purple dragon (Malefor) and are related to darkness.
B.What About Cynder's Fire?
This was something given to her by the Dark Master and she only had it as Dark Cynder. You'll notice that her fire in ANB was weaker than Spyro's most basic flame attacks and it was an odd, mutated, purplish color, which indicates that it was never her power to begin with.
C.If Cynder had gained these abilities during her dark form why didn't she ever used them?
Overconfidence would be my guess. And perhaps she couldn't use them when she was corrupted (we don't actually know what her attacks in DotD look like, after all, so we don't know if they'd be possible for her to use). This is, ultimately, a very minor nit pick.

A.As I said, Extra abilities can not be "put on", only the purple dragons can sommon new abilities for themselves, they cant put other abilities on dragons, then Spyro could've given powers to Ignitus, or the other guardians. And no, as story said, Spyro, even though he's a purple dragon, can not control all elements. I see it as the purple dragon can control more than one element, though non-purple dragons can only control one.

B.Yeah i know, but if Cynder took the other 3 abilities with her, why not that one.

C.Minor? its still a plothole. I think it would be pretty obvious if she did use them against Spyro in her dark form. She would create tornadoes, Try to Poison Spyro, Do something to do with shaows, and she would scare the daylights out of Spyro with her fear ability.
Overcomfidence? No way, She was getting smashed by Spyro, and I'm sure that she just wanted to Finish Spyro off quickly to please the Dark Master. Cynder didn't really seem very cocky anyway.

D.Heres an extra one, why is Cynder only discovering them now? I mean she would've discovered wind before, seing thats supposed to be her prime ability. Spyro discovered his flame without Even knowing he had an ability, and i dont just think thats because hes a purple dragon. And she had 3 extra ones to discover too, and she's already used them so many times in her dark form, I'd be surpised if she didn't have still the instict to be able to use it, i mean she supposively kept all the horrible memories of when she was at war against the dragons.

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Ratchet's dawn of the Dragon Discussion THread

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