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#1 May 12, 2010 10:22 PM
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What Was Cut
So, originally EtD could have been a decently long sequel to YoTD, but as we all know - it was rushed to capitalize on holiday sales back in 2002, and much was cut and glitches ensued.
I am actually a fan of EtD. It is the last console Spyro game to fully mimic the Insomniac style - there are portals, the characters are designed in the "Spyro style" (big goofy eyes, and they do that weird 'look this way/that way' move with their bodies), Stewart Copeland music, original voice actors, etc.
I'm not saying its production values were better than say, DotD, but it was the closest thing to an "Insomniac Sequel" we ever got for consoles (the Season trilogy mimicked Insomniac, but the handheld games are another matter...)
Anyways, I am trying to figure out all that was cut from the game. I could use your help! Anything you have heard (and could confirm) was intended to be included in the game, but wasn't, post here!
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#2 May 12, 2010 10:56 PM
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Re: What Was Cut
I'll start.
~~~~
Check out the GameCube art:
http://www.darkspyro.net/dragonfly/imag … _large.jpg
The door in the castle is open and there's a light being emitted - could this have originally been another portal?
~~~~
http://www.youtube.com/LXShadow - who uses GameShark to hack games, said he found an unused level name in the PAL version EtD - "Enchanted Forest" (earlier, I mistakenly reported it was called "Enchanted Castles") and 10 unused dragonfly names.
~~~~
A member who was active at the original Spyro forums (not the current Activision forums or the Sierra forums - so two official forums ago) who I was friends with, but his name now escapes me (he was working on the Minibag's Madness game, I think his name was goldpsarx04) - anyways, he had a friend who saw concept art from the game that has since disappeared from the internet - and there was a Tree Tops style level.
Could this concept art have been for Enchanted Forest?
~~~~
Originally Gnasty Gnorc and Ripto were going to work together.
The game was touted for its DVD format - because that meant "fast load times" and a smooth 60 frames per second, which as we know, never happened.
A rocket and surfboard were two promised vehicles that never came to be.
Depending upon who was reporting, 25 to 30 levels were promised.
Unless mini games, vehicle levels, speedways, and slides are included in that count - there were only 8 levels, a home world, and the boss realm. So 10 levels. I don't think they would call slides and mini games "levels" so that means anywhere from 15 to 20 levels were scrapped.
Some hints at what these levels could be comes from the press release, which promised "unique environments including rainbows, tornadoes, and monsoons" ... there was no monsoon or tornado level (there were rainbows, but no rainbow-specific level).
The press release claimed there would be "over 100 dragonflies" - the final game had 90.
_________
If anyone here saw early concept art, a long-lost press release, knows how to hack, etc. and knows what else was going to be in this game - please let me know!
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#3 May 13, 2010 12:06 AM
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Re: What Was Cut
Wow I didn't know all that until now
I think the game would have been so much better
But don't get me wrong I liked the game
Rawr!!! I'm a Dragon :3
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#4 May 13, 2010 12:52 AM
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Re: What Was Cut
Yeah, it certainly could have been better if it had the originally promised levels, characters, vehicles - but for what it is, it's okay.
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#5 May 13, 2010 1:58 AM
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Re: What Was Cut
Yeah, it certainly could have been better if it had the originally promised levels, characters, vehicles - but for what it is, it's okay.
Yeah I would have love to seen more
It not a bad game but there not much of a story line
And it does get boring after awhile
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#6 May 13, 2010 7:48 AM
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Re: What Was Cut
Thanks for this, i never ever knew.
I also didn't know you were still active.
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#7 May 13, 2010 12:34 PM
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Re: What Was Cut
The thing that irritated me about the game was the fact that it took ages to load and Spyro moved slow as well; I remember playing YOTD afterwards and I was almost overwelmed when Spyro was zipping about with only the slightest touch of the analog stick! XD
The idea that there was a lot cut out is interesting though, on the whole I did actually enjoy the game and it would have been much better if it were longer.
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#8 May 13, 2010 1:18 PM
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Re: What Was Cut
It's a real shame they rushed this thing. It had so much potential. The surfboard is a real shame, that could have been a real winner if done correctly.
Although, this level, Enchanted Castles..... Is there no other info? Like, were they able to get the level/part of the level up and running? What were the unused names?
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#9 May 13, 2010 7:35 PM
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Re: What Was Cut
Just heard back from LXShadow and have some more information:
"Hi there,
This idea of yours sounds most interesting! I'm actually always watching the Spyro Forums, but unfortunately I'm quite pathetic when it comes to posting on public boards!
I hope you won't mind if I give some input on this as well. First of all, I'd like to mention that yearofthe - who I've conversed with over YouTube - has mis-quoted me a bit.
There are a few things in the game that the community doesn't know about yet. Firstly, the name of the supposed cut level was actually "Enchanted Forest". It may or may not have ever been made. If you ask me, the name suggests that it may have been a bonus level. Perhaps you'd have been taken there by the mysterious cut portal in the castle - just a guess though. The level has no data files, so there's no way to access it- on the PAL version at least.
There is a mention of another possible cut vehicle in the code. Being called only "Mech", though, I can't really know what it is.
I think the game also has some unmentioned cheat codes - I can't remember what they all were, but there are only two left: "AtlasCheat" and "External Camera". I'm not sure whether there's anything special about the AtlasCheat, but if you have a second controller you can hold down L3 + X (on one of the controllers - I forgot which!) during gameplay to use the external camera to explore around a level. Although it's incredibly slow!
AtlasCheat is activated using Square + Select, but I don't know what it really does.
Thanks for your interest. I think that's all I have at the moment. I can look through a bit more later; but for now, back to hacking Spyro 3!"
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#10 May 13, 2010 8:58 PM
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Re: What Was Cut
Hm.... I'd love to try that camera trick and see if there's anything behind that castle door XD
Does this work on any console?
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#11 May 13, 2010 10:59 PM
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Re: What Was Cut
I'll test my GameCube copy ASAP - albeit, it will be through the Wii - not sure if that will change the outcome...
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#12 May 14, 2010 2:01 AM
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Re: What Was Cut
Hm.... I'd love to try that camera trick and see if there's anything behind that castle door XD
Does this work on any console?
at least on the PS2.
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#13 May 14, 2010 7:24 AM
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Re: What Was Cut
http://www.gamespot.com/ps2/action/spyr … id=6090061
http://www.thefreelibrary.com/Universal … a088595370
http://www.thefreelibrary.com/Universal … a094436362
http://www.thefreelibrary.com/Universal … a093977872
I did a quick search based on my internet link resources I have in my computer. Do any of those four help?
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#14 May 14, 2010 6:59 PM
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Re: What Was Cut
All of those were interesting press releases that I have never read/seen before - thank you for seeking them out!
However, as all of those press releases were issued after the game was completed - they don't offer hints about what was cut, they only detail what we know/find was included.
Thank you again, though, for contributing!
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#15 Sep 08, 2010 12:45 PM
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Re: What Was Cut
Oddly enough, there were three Stewart Copeland songs which didn't make it in the final game. One was called Andes, another was called Mid Flute and the third one was called Songa.
Didn't Copeland admit to making the songs straight after he played a Spyro level? This probably means that there are 13 levels on the disk itself. I might be wrong, though.
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#16 Oct 20, 2010 8:55 PM
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Re: What Was Cut
Here's a copy-and-paste message I got from LXShadow:
"I think the lack-of-levels problem occurred because the developer really wasn't suited for games development. If I remember correctly Enter the Dragonfly was their first game. It was also a result of a two-studio collaboration, which probably complicated things a lot.
It is most likely that levels were cut - but as for how many, I'm not sure. We do know of one, but the others remain completely unknown (unless it's a Sparx level, because there is evidence for that). Were in not for the language barrier (Equinoxe, the studio that did the environments, appears to be foreign), we might be able to find some actual level content. But perhaps if we're feeling brave, one of us could ask the designers.
Stewart Copeland, on the other hand, probably gets a lot of fan-mail due to his popularity. But nonetheless, good luck! Like you said, it won't hurt to ask. Hopefully you'll have better luck than I do (any of my attempts to contact a developer so far have failed quite miserably!).
By the way - here's the "evidence" for the Sparx levels:
Spyro_UserSparx::InitializeFromEDF(Graph_Constructor*,SPYRO_EDF_data_struct&)
Spyro_UserSparx::InitializeFromPriorEntity(Graph_Constructor*,Spyro_Entities*)
Spyro_UserSparx::FindBodyParts()
Spyro_UserSparx::UpdateTranslation(float)
Spyro_UserSparx::Update(float)
Spyro_UserSparx::FireNormalWeapon()
Spyro_UserSparx::FireAlternateWeapon()
Spyro_UserSparx::InitializeAfterLoad()
Spyro_UserSparx::Teleport(const EntryPoint*)
Spyro_UserSparx::TakeDamage(DAMAGE_TYPE,bool)
Spyro_UserSparx::PreRender(c6Renderer*,c6SceneGraph*,c6RENDER_LIST**)
Spyro_UserSparx::ProcessCollisions(Spyro_BSPManager*)
Spyro_UserSparx::UpdateHierarchy(c6Matrix4D&,c6BoundingBox&,bool)
I also found some lines in the game that I didn't recognise. Does this ring any bells?
Farmer guy: "Pick up all the butterfly bottles before the time runs out to win! Let's go!"
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#17 Sep 13, 2011 9:46 AM
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Re: What Was Cut
Sorry to bump this topic! But it wasn't until a few days ago that I found a bit more information on this game.
A friend of mine managed to give me part of a demo disc with Spyro: Enter the Dragonfly on it. It's fortunately an early build, and although I haven't been able to play it, there is quite a bit of plaintext leftover information in its files.
"FlyCheat" {LStick&L2&R}
#"FlyCheat" {Square&Triangle&Circle&X}
This isn't much, but it tells us how Check Six dealt with their cheats. To open the cheat menu, you'd originally press Square + Triangle + Circle + X, but it seems Check Six eventually changed their minds (too many buttons!) and had the players press L3 + L2 + right arrow to do it. The button codes weren't left in the final version, but it looks like anyone could have used the cheat in this demo.
"WingShield" {L1&R1&L2&R2}
This is another example of a time before C6 realised their button combinations were too complicated. =P
The demo also has much more evidence of the planned Enchanted Forest (A.K.A "Emerald Forest" - make up your minds, C6!). However, there is still no evidence that the level was ever built. There don't seem to be any Atlas images of the level:
Page 17
{
#Jurassic Jungle
{ 0.1 0.1 Text 367 27 }
{ 0.5 0.4 Image "icon_at_jj.mrb" 22 }
{ 0.1 0.8 LevelField 1 Completion }
}[...]
Page 19
{
#Enchanted Forest
{ 0.1 0.1 Text 368 28 }
{ 0.1 0.8 LevelField 1 Completion }
}
Finally, here's a copy-paste of all the game's script I found in the demo files:
(There are probably many minor differences, but be sure to look out for Emerald Forests, talking baskets and sphere-evading butterfly challenges!)
Hope I haven't gone too far by posting the entire script. =P While I'm at it, though, I'd just like to go off-topic and criticise Check Six for not implementing backface culling. Backface culling is where the backs of polygons aren't shown, giving the system a big speedup. It's astounding that Check Six couldn't do this, especially when the game lagged terribly to begin with. Along with many functions labelled with e.g "DO NOT USE, BROKEN", this greatly disappoints me.
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#18 Sep 13, 2011 8:21 PM
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Re: What Was Cut
860: "*bleep*"
O_o?
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#19 Feb 28, 2013 6:16 AM
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Re: What Was Cut
Does anyone know how to rip textures from the game?
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#20 May 10, 2013 8:37 PM
- yearofthe
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Re: What Was Cut
Sorry to bump this topic! But it wasn't until a few days ago that I found a bit more information on this game.
A friend of mine managed to give me part of a demo disc with Spyro: Enter the Dragonfly on it. It's fortunately an early build, and although I haven't been able to play it, there is quite a bit of plaintext leftover information in its files.
"FlyCheat" {LStick&L2&R}
#"FlyCheat" {Square&Triangle&Circle&X}This isn't much, but it tells us how Check Six dealt with their cheats. To open the cheat menu, you'd originally press Square + Triangle + Circle + X, but it seems Check Six eventually changed their minds (too many buttons!) and had the players press L3 + L2 + right arrow to do it. The button codes weren't left in the final version, but it looks like anyone could have used the cheat in this demo.
"WingShield" {L1&R1&L2&R2}
This is another example of a time before C6 realised their button combinations were too complicated. =P
The demo also has much more evidence of the planned Enchanted Forest (A.K.A "Emerald Forest" - make up your minds, C6!). However, there is still no evidence that the level was ever built. There don't seem to be any Atlas images of the level:
Page 17
{
#Jurassic Jungle
{ 0.1 0.1 Text 367 27 }
{ 0.5 0.4 Image "icon_at_jj.mrb" 22 }
{ 0.1 0.8 LevelField 1 Completion }
}[...]
Page 19
{
#Enchanted Forest
{ 0.1 0.1 Text 368 28 }
{ 0.1 0.8 LevelField 1 Completion }
}Finally, here's a copy-paste of all the game's script I found in the demo files:
▼Hidden text(There are probably many minor differences, but be sure to look out for Emerald Forests, talking baskets and sphere-evading butterfly challenges!)
Hope I haven't gone too far by posting the entire script. =P While I'm at it, though, I'd just like to go off-topic and criticise Check Six for not implementing backface culling. Backface culling is where the backs of polygons aren't shown, giving the system a big speedup. It's astounding that Check Six couldn't do this, especially when the game lagged terribly to begin with. Along with many functions labelled with e.g "DO NOT USE, BROKEN", this greatly disappoints me.
Sparx: "You just won a race or time attack but I don't know which one until I get fixed!"
Sorry to bump this up! Is it possible "Thieves Den" replaced "Emerald Forest"? It seems the only level missing from that script is "Thieves Den". So maybe that level replaced it? Plus, on the "Atlas Strings", "Enchanted Forest" seems to be a scrapped level, rather than one being replaced. Every level is there except "Emerald Forest", and they developed "Thieves Den" instead. And maybe "Enchanted Forest" was supposed to replace "Emerald Forest", but didn't because of time restraints.
You know, the game was released in October, and it had to be due by Christmas. So maybe they should've given around two more months and we could've had a level. Meh, on second thought, the game was in development for a LONG time, so one more level would've been too much. Maybe fix the some glitches instead?
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#21 May 11, 2013 7:33 PM
- LXShadow
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Re: What Was Cut
That's a good theory, but with the information we have being a little inconsistent to begin with (Thieves Den has an Atlas image like the other levels; only the Forest level(s) don't), it's hard to prove anything either way...
The one problem with the idea is that, if they had planned Emerald Forest before Thieves' Den (scripts and all), and they were under time constraints, then replacing it with an entirely new level - Thieves' Den - would've been costly. In the name of super-efficiency, they would have finished Emerald Forest first if it existed, and then began Thieves' Den in that order... Although Check Six might not strike everyone as 'super-efficient'. =P
Maybe the easiest guess is that priorities changed. They might have been working on levels in a random-ish manner, before time caught up with them and they realised they had to prioritise the earlier levels ahead of the later, more difficult ones. The end result in that case would have been a rushed Thieves' Den with scripts and all completed; while the barely-started Enchanted Forest is left in the dust.
I think, also, they would have gone for 10 levels rather than 11. This matches up well with the list of exactly 100 dragonflies left in the final game.
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#22 May 11, 2013 7:43 PM
- yearofthe
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Re: What Was Cut
That's a good theory, but with the information we have being a little inconsistent to begin with (Thieves Den has an Atlas image like the other levels; only the Forest level(s) don't), it's hard to prove anything either way...
The one problem with the idea is that, if they had planned Emerald Forest before Thieves' Den (scripts and all), and they were under time constraints, then replacing it with an entirely new level - Thieves' Den - would've been costly. In the name of super-efficiency, they would have finished Emerald Forest first if it existed, and then began Thieves' Den in that order... Although Check Six might not strike everyone as 'super-efficient'. =P
Maybe the easiest guess is that priorities changed. They might have been working on levels in a random-ish manner, before time caught up with them and they realised they had to prioritise the earlier levels ahead of the later, more difficult ones. The end result in that case would have been a rushed Thieves' Den with scripts and all completed; while the barely-started Enchanted Forest is left in the dust.
I think, also, they would have gone for 10 levels rather than 11. This matches up well with the list of exactly 100 dragonflies left in the final game.
I see. I just thought they didn't like the idea of Emerald Forest. On another note, someone over at darkSpyro posted some more beta script that looks like it's from an Airplane mini game.
Also, here are the unused dragonfly names!
It sounds like a Tree Tops level to me! I remember I sent you a message some years ago when I got an e-mail from someone who worked on the game that said they were planning a Tree Tops like level next, but couldn't because of time.
I quote from the first post on this topic:
A member who was active at the original Spyro forums (not the current Activision forums or the Sierra forums - so two official forums ago) who I was friends with, but his name now escapes me (he was working on the Minibag's Madness game, I think his name was goldpsarx04) - anyways, he had a friend who saw concept art from the game that has since disappeared from the internet - and there was a Tree Tops style level.
Could this concept art have been for Enchanted Forest?
Gosh, now I'm really sad we didn't get to see the light of the level.
Source for beta script and dragonfies: http://forum.darkspyro.net/spyro/viewpo … opic=64389
EDIT: I found more stuff! This time some press releases from before the game AND at E3! The game was already at 60fps and they said the professor was back, but he isn't present in the final. Also a new attack, which isn't present in the game, is the new super head smash.
Also, judging from the users, the game was to be released on November 5, 2002 instead of November 3rd.
Source: http://www.neoseeker.com/forums/3722/t1 … ease-date/
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#23 Jul 22, 2013 5:39 AM
- ccrogers15
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Re: What Was Cut
That script above is fake. I have both the black and red label copy on PS2 and ive searched and combed the entire disc, and none of those lines appear. Spyrobeta on darkspyro was lying.
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#24 Dec 06, 2013 2:02 PM
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Re: What Was Cut
Sorry for the late reply here, but later on i will check both the game and the Demo for any of the voices to those cut lines. The demo that i have doesn't contain any voices in the game, so i doubt it will have any in the disc, but who knows until we try.
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#25 Dec 06, 2013 11:08 PM
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Re: What Was Cut
Alright, i have checked the entire disc's voice clips. Unfortunately, nothing from Emerald Forest is present, but there are a few odd things and lots of the clips are different from the beta script that was posted earlier. Also, the Demo has sounds for the Enemies, but oddly the game doesn't use them. Maybe they didn't implement them at that time?
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